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Post by darkflame on May 25, 2015 22:18:31 GMT -5
Let me say first that the buff master is awesome he definitely helps with buffs of all classes and gives you a fighting chance before you go out to hunt and level. But what the buff master isn't suppose to do is have spells better then the main class of buffs in those categories. Which makes a reason to make druids, shamans, clerics because when you make them you know that top end spell is going to be better then whatever that buff master tosses out in your line of spells. Now when you have a 80 cleric and 80% of all your spells get super seeded due to the buff master having higher ranking spells then cleric in each category what else can a cleric do? So lets talk about what clerics can do when it comes to the buff category. Their top spells for cleric can use mitigation and spell haste. Rallied Shield of Vie Rk III (melee mitigation dmg absorb) and Aura of Resolve Rk III (spell Haste). Rallied needs a remake to counter the high damage zones of mobs and their hits. It currently mitigates 10% melee damage but for only 3000 damage which is basically one punch to the face making the spell worthless. Aura of Resolve gives you no real spell haste boost if your already at cap. The spell says cap is 3.0 seconds but even with spells above 3.0 if its already capped nothing happens. Should they make this spell act as over haste for casters? They do have devine intervention which is cool but nothing that a #bot can't do for free with not materials so... Maybe juice it up some I don't know just seems like whatever clerics can do for other ppl other ppl can already get from other sources. Enchanters have HOI, Shamans have Lass/Panther, avoidance melee higher buff ect, Druids Reptile. Not just that even the spells that the buff bot cast when called apon each class mentioned usually has a higher version of that spell in spell book making them more valuable. Shouldn't cleric have spells that only they cast at 80 that are better then the buff masters spells. Shouldn't they have something that says man I need to have a cleric cause this ability is just sick. I know there was some issues before about clerics being gods and had to get re balanced for this server. But they definitely need a relook on some of the spells to make them just as valuable as the other classes for what they do in a group/box. If im out in the left field on this one my apologies but I wanted to try boxing something different besides just shamans and cleric just feels like they are missing something that they shouldn't. Just a thought good hunting and thanks for any feedback I really do love what you gm's and master of code do with the game and server. Enjoy your day!  |
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Post by jezril on May 25, 2015 23:02:30 GMT -5
You're 100% correct, I was thinking about making a cleric to replace my shaman because lassitude just lags me the fuzzy rainbow kitten out and cougar is pretty much worthless now thanks to imperiums fury (not complaining, I think its awesome.)
But, these are exactly the reasons I haven't made a cleric.
In these new zones you really need some sort of uber mitigation coupled with quick heals IMO.
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Post by spuds on May 26, 2015 9:13:55 GMT -5
The only "problem " here is that bots can be instantly summoned and dismissed so if the buffs are available to bots you just replace hailing the buff bot with cycling through summoned buff bots. Of course I guess there's ways to make spells off limits to bots?
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Post by jezril on May 26, 2015 9:21:18 GMT -5
The only "problem " here is that bots can be instantly summoned and dismissed so if the buffs are available to bots you just replace hailing the buff bot with cycling through summoned buff bots. Of course I guess there's ways to make spells off limits to bots? Bots are limited if I recall. They're not controlled by imperium but eqemu as a whole. I think bots get max level buffs to level 70 if I'm not mistaken? |
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Post by adonhiram on May 26, 2015 9:56:56 GMT -5
Yes, I think that's correct, level 70 max due to EQemu code. On the other hand, my chanter bot, after the spell changes in last patch, was able to DC Festerback which helped a lot against nameds in F2 <--don't read that, it's not very interesting  |
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Post by Vinlar on May 26, 2015 10:56:03 GMT -5
Hrm, might be removing DC from bots. Lol that's pretty broken an army of bots with DCd pets. But on the cleric point good ideas and valid points will look into this class next.
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Post by yunke on May 26, 2015 13:05:37 GMT -5
The buff cler problem is the same as shaman. I never used my HoS line spells since buff bot give a better one Now with the imperium fury item, the mammoth line spell its only used for the 10% mitigation, not bad, tbh Its like the Sta buff line, never casted it cuz the buff bot its better. Dont want to remove or delevel the buff bot buff, but the ones that are casted from real shamans / Clers, should be better than that. IF not whats the point on get that box ?  ( There are lots of things, dont missread it ) And for bots, is there any option to buff mage bot pets ? Not to be like the real mage pets, but at least to be a bit better ? |
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Post by darkflame on May 26, 2015 13:47:09 GMT -5
The buff cler problem is the same as shaman. I never used my HoS line spells since buff bot give a better one Now with the imperium fury item, the mammoth line spell its only used for the 10% mitigation, not bad, tbh Its like the Sta buff line, never casted it cuz the buff bot its better. Dont want to remove or delevel the buff bot buff, but the ones that are casted from real shamans / Clers, should be better than that. IF not whats the point on get that box ? ( There are lots of things, dont missread it ) And for bots, is there any option to buff mage bot pets ? Not to be like the real mage pets, but at least to be a bit better ? Yea by all means I do not want to mess up anything with the Buff Master . I agree with what everyone is saying, the top end spells for all the support classes need to be above or = to at least the buff master. With the addition of custom zones comes custom damage and the heroic modifier only works for heals being able to keep up with heal items. Buffs, runes, mitigation, speed, ac, hp, ect. don't change at all no matter how good of the gear you get. Maybe this should change. Maybe you should add a stat modifier to the gear that gives more AC on buff more HP on buff more mitigation on buff or rune on buff. Or even add a cap like you have a 20k healing cap for heals and a 25 k spell damage cap. Have a certain amount of cap for buffs/stats/shields/ect. So like 15k on hp buff, 13k on ac buff, 10% on overhaste stat, 20 k on rune buffs so that when you get gear your buffs grow with you in every category. Or you can take the same mindset with some of the changes you did with the pet classes and runes. Then mold it into lines of spells that fit each support class to make them viable not over powered but very useful and a sound piece to a successful box or group member. Alot of the spell lines don't stack and literally you just have one line of spell. Maybe even opening up individual lines and letting them stack with the main group lines would be start to turn the tide on value after you tweak the spells a bit. Like you have your Aegolisms and let your pure AC, HP, Guards, and so on stack with that. So it then doesn't feel like those individual channels of spells are a waste. Just a thought hopefully this sparks some great ideas. Thanks again for all the feedback much appreciated. |
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Post by Vinlar on May 26, 2015 15:13:17 GMT -5
Allowing lines to stack is not a bad idea, my concern is of course buff slots. That would just exacerbate the current issue with those. Still discussing with other devs on the spell slots, should hopefully have an answer soon.
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Post by Atrayas on May 26, 2015 17:27:44 GMT -5
I'll help vinlar brainstorm some new and exciting ways to make a cleric viable in the future. There are a few approaches we can take with this class and I agree they have been under utilized for some time now.
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Post by darkflame on May 26, 2015 20:05:24 GMT -5
Allowing lines to stack is not a bad idea, my concern is of course buff slots. That would just exacerbate the current issue with those. Still discussing with other devs on the spell slots, should hopefully have an answer soon. This is true but it will start giving people options to choose on what buffs they would like to have. Whats important to them and what they can discard. Do you really need some of the buffs that are given. You can toss sow, clarity, dmg shield, and or other things in many cases and sub them out for something greater for that playing style or vice versa you wouldn't need melee haste as a caster. So it can then turn into a little chess game that most wouldn't complain about knowing that they have alot of good options to choose from to mold themselves into their playing style. |
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Post by darkflame on May 26, 2015 20:07:01 GMT -5
I'll help vinlar brainstorm some new and exciting ways to make a cleric viable in the future. There are a few approaches we can take with this class and I agree they have been under utilized for some time now. Well i know you guys do great work and this actually can be things transformed into not just clerics but shamans and druids as well for some of the generalize concepts that work with each support class. If you want brainstorming ideas opened to the forum just say the word and what you looking for and let the ideas roll in . Thanks again and good work on everything so far. |
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Post by Vinlar on May 26, 2015 20:56:13 GMT -5
Always open to ideas.
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Post by adonhiram on May 26, 2015 21:41:20 GMT -5
Don't remove DC from bots, Vinlar :-) Anyhow as soon a mob has a heavy aoe bots die (soloing the three first nameds in F2 was ok with charmed Festerback, but on Albino bots died so quickly that I got Festerback on my ass after 30 seconds...). Don't punish me for experimenting creative things, I am not a SK with ubaaaa lifetaptanking abilities, hey ! Should have shut my mouth, bah  |
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Post by jezril on May 26, 2015 21:45:38 GMT -5
Don't remove DC from bots, Vinlar :-) Anyhow as soon a mob has a heavy aoe bots die (soloing the three first nameds in F2 was ok with charmed Festerback, but on Albino bots died so quickly that I got Festerback on my ass after 30 seconds...). Don't punish me for experimenting creative things, I am not a SK with ubaaaa lifetaptanking abilities, hey ! Should have shut my mouth, bah In agree with this. I see the enchanter bots being able to dire charm things a bad thing really, Lol. Because once they die, you got some pissed off mobs on ya. |
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( There are lots of things, dont missread it 
